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Put Those Police Cameras on Bankers

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This copy is mirrored from CounterPunch.

American Police are the Gatekeepers of the National Inequality Policy

Put Those Police Cameras on Bankers

by JESSE JACKSON
A week ago Sunday, five St. Louis Rams professional football players entered a game with their hands up, protesting the killing of Michael Brown. They stand in the lineage of John Carlos and Tommie Smith, of Muhammad Ali, identifying with the pain in their communities and turning protest into power.The gesture turned tochants — “Hands up; Don’t Shoot” in demonstrations across the country. Protesters shut down major thoroughfares from Manhattan to Chicago to Los Angeles to decry the Staten Island grand jury that refused to indict the policemen who killed Eric Garner, turning his plea — “I can’t breathe” — into a call for justice.In these cases, there was no cross examination and thus no indictments. “Justice” rings hollow across the nation. Injustice reins.

These demonstrations, largely by young and remarkably multi-racial crowds, are not the first. They were preceded by Occupy Wall Street, indicting the 1 percent and spreading to hundreds of cities. They were foreshadowed by the dreamers, children demanding the right to come out of the shadows of the undocumented.

They were accompanied by record numbers of workers in low wage jobs at fast food restaurants and the Dollar Stores walking off their jobs in some 190 cities.

They were complemented by women demanding gender equality, particularly at the workplace where discrimination and sexism are still rife.

The streams of alienation and disparities are converging into a river. Injustices in this new age are not only inflammable, they are increasingly inflamed.

The official reaction to police immunity for the killing of unarmed black boys and men Ferguson and Staten Island and Cleveland and Brooklyn has focused, not surprisingly, on the police. The president has created a Task Force on 21st Century Policy, with instructions to report in 90 days. He’s committed millions to put cameras on police.

But he might be better advised to put cameras on bankers. Reckless, unaccountable and murderous police behavior must end, but the police are simply the gatekeepers assigned to keep order.

Behind the gate is the American policy of isolating poor people of color in ghettos, ghettos deprived of jobs, of capital, of decent health care, of affordable housing, of good schools.

Police are assigned to patrol these zones of despair, part of the only thriving industry in these neighborhoods — the jail-industrial complex of more police, police stations, courthouses, bondsmen, jailors, judges, lawyers and prosecutors, court recorders and guards and much more. In this pressure cooker, all of us are vulnerable — none of us are safe until all of us are safe.

In the Civil Rights Movement, the Bull Connors were the violent enforcers. But they were not the issue: The issue was legal segregation that deprived African Americans of their rights and locked them into second-class citizenship.

Today, the police killing of unarmed Blacks is unacceptable and reaching crisis proportions. But the issue is a national policy that abandons poor people of color in their ghettos. If we put cameras on the police, we may get better policing and less injustice (although Eric Garner’s killing was on camera). But what we need is an urban development policy that attacks segregation by race, rebuilds poor neighborhoods, invests in the health and education of poor infants and children, erects affordable housing, offers training for and transport to jobs that exist.

The demonstrations are about justice for Michael Brown and Eric Garner and others that can be and will be added to the list. But they aren’t just about those killings. They are about a national ghetto policy, a national worker impoverishment policy, a national inequality policy.

The slogan “No justice, no peace,” reverberates throughout the country. And the demonstrations are growing and spreading. Different streams of protest are coming together. Occupy Wall Street exposed the 1 percent. The strikes of low wage workers expose the global corporations. The “Hands up, Don’t Shoot” demonstrations expose the harsh injustices of the jail-industrial complex.

Dr. Martin Luther King taught us: “There comes a time when one must take a position that is neither safe, nor politics, nor popular, but one must take it because it is right.” Today, across America, more and more Americans are standing up for what is right.

Jesse Jackson is the founder of Rainbow/PUSH.

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Eric Kirk’s Brilliant Act of Justification

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[UPDATE :: Sickness Incarnate]

 
 Below are a couple of following comments to the posting below – I just had to indulge. You just can’t get anymore disconnected than Eric Kirk is here. The pure outpouring of malevolent hatred for anyone that doesn’t submit to him, his right to judge, is astounding. This state of mind is where physical violence starts.

Yeh, well all I am trying to say is that at some point…we have to acknowledge that God (any and all of them) is not going to rescue us from ourselves.

Do we want to take responsibility at some point? If people really want to emulate this ‘godness’, with humility, peace and fairness – whats stopping them?

Could it be the endless character assassination, ridicule and bullying?

NAN – I should apologize. You’re mentally ill. You can’t help yourself. Get help!

And I get that you’re an expert because you took a Jewish studies survey course as a sophomore in college. And you watched Fiddler on the Roof. I get it. [Emphasis mine]


These kinds of Elitist Demigods are a threat to everyone. Something these mockers might take to heart:

Elisha Mocked
“Then he went up from there to Bethel; and as he was going up by the way, young lads came out from the city and mocked him and said to him, “Go up, you baldhead; go up, you baldhead!” When he looked behind him and saw them, he cursed them in the name of the LORD. Then two female bears came out of the woods and tore up forty-two lads of their number. He went from there to Mount Carmel, and from there he returned to Samaria.” -2 Kings 2:23-25.


Dead Right and Still Alive – That’s my motto!

Don’t you just love it when you’re proven RIGHT?

In past blog comments I’ve had considerable to say about the Brownshirt movement that is strong and assertive at particular local blogs. These racist, bigoted hypocrites took great exception to me and my right to make observations on their blogs. When they got personal, I took exception. These people, for the most part, live in this community, work and play, where I live. If you can terrorize and commit blog murder, a form of censorship, lie, slander and commit further acts of hate, you are a threat to this community. Some of these blogs are nothing more than gossip-mongering hen houses, just spreading the hate and filthy lying accusations. It may seem like harmless opinionating, but cut across a lie or try defending your own personal integrity against and you suddenly are confronted with a pack of rabid dogs trying to rip out your throat. What these Brownshirt thugs don’t realize, and I’m primarily talking about those running blogs, is that what they dish out is what they receive as their reward.

That is why when I read Eric Kirk’s latest act of hysteria, I just had to point it out for everyone. When I objected to Kirk’s personal attack like this on me, he censored me from his blog. Here he is in his own filthy words:

August 28, 2014 at 11:51 pm

Eric Kirk

NAN, you are either deliberately dense or so fucking stupid it’s pathetic. No way am I going to waste any effort responding to that bullshit. It’s the most pathetic and vindictive crap you’ve written to date, and that’s really saying something.

The one that is “dense and so fucking stupid” is Eric Kirk. He is a classic example of the Elitist demi-gods in our society telling everyone else how to think, believe and act. Yet, they are totally clueless, as I’ve pointed out and substantiated many time in the past. So, for your enlightenment you can draw your own conclusions. Here is the comment he was referring to:

August 28, 2014 at 9:27 pm

Not A Native

Eric first asserts the following:
I do not endeavor to “characterize” Israeli society.

And then he proceeds to establish his relevance and bonafides precisely by characterizing in very narrow terms the few people with Jewish ancestry he’s encountered

“….having been immersed in socialist left wing politics all of my life which is very heavily Jewish influenced

my in-law Jewish family on the subject, including my wife’s communist grandmother,”

Though Israeli may be a very diverse lot, the Jews Eric whole expereince is with certainly aren’t but it supports the stereotype Eric wants to promulgate and reinforce, Jews are left wing. Eric is sickening because he truly believes the form of antisemitism that falsely characterizes Jews as being anarchists and revolutionaries.

But that’s not enough for Eric. The most damning form of antisemtism he’s yet divulged is to come:

But they[Israelis] are brought together by the fact that they are broadly hated in the west as “Zionists,” “Christ killers,” and in recent decades “infidels.”

And Eric can’t understand why a Jewish homeland in Germany was rejected

While Nazi antisemitism denied Jews humanity, Eric’s is more insidious. He denies Jews their religion. and declares them to be defined as the objects of others’ hatred. In that way, Eric promotes a recasting of Toynbeeism.

What truly unites Jews is devotion to their holy scripture. For the sake of that alone, many Jews have chosen death. The willingness to sacrifice for that, if absolutely necessary, is what perpetuates the Jewish nation. And other Jews have forsaken it, choosing to assimilate and pass on only shadows of a former heritage.

The disaffected, alienated, or disgruntled Jews are among the ones Eric encountered and has extrapolated onto all Jews and Israeli society. His ideas about Jews in general and Israelis in particular are just stereotypes from the political camp he takes in as whole cloth and denies Jews their Jewishness.

Just a few Israeli self reflections:

http://blogs.jpost.com/content/why-i-am-not-orthodox-or-secular

http://blogs.jpost.com/content/zionism-or-toynbeeism

http://www.think-israel.org/rosenberg.herzogtoynbeedebate.html

And to further demonstrate my “rightness” – my total justification for standing against these parasites:

August 29, 2014 at 6:36 am

Mitch

I’m standard-issue secular American Jew. The Jewish people I grew up with very definitely considered themselves “to be defined as the objects of others’ hatred.” Nearly to a one, we had no interest in scripture. We defined ourselves by our maintenance of various traditions associated with the religion, but nobody believed God was involved in the events the traditions celebrated. Matzoh is not belief.

August 29, 2014 at 7:12 am

Not A Native

Eric, an old layers expression: ‘When the facts are with you, pound the facts. When the facts are against you, pound the table’.

Your only response is table pounding. and cursing. Gee, how much critical thinking and deep understanding does that display? [Emphasis mine]

Mitch, your response exactly matches my points. “Standard secular American Jews”(its an absurd notion that a secular Jew is ‘standard’) aren’t a continuing line or predecessors for a future Jewish nation or Jewish State. You’re Toynbee’s poster child of why Jews shouldn’t exist today.

So, there you are. If you go to this comment (click on the date) and follow along, since writing this observation Eric has apologized with his usual hypocritical sarcasm and ridicule. An apology is not worth the words when you continue to justify your right to do what you did in the first place – keep right on attacking and terrorizing.

Kirk and his apologists totally delegitimized themselves.

–Joe

Written by Joe Blow

August 29, 2014 at 7:45 pm

Why I Love Living In Eureka

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082714_FreddieBoy

[Latest UPDATE] [UPDATE II – In his own words]

Why I love living in Eureka, CA.

Eureka is just full of these kinds of people – don’t you just love them? Given the opportunity they’ll tell you what brand of toilet paper you should use, if any. Read this and weep folks.


WEDNESDAY, AUGUST 27, 2014

Why Repair Brick Chimneys?

This article in the Santa Rosa Press- Democrat got me to thinking about something again. The article is about a kid in Napa that had a chimney fall on him during their earthquake of a few days ago. It nearly killed him. I had to wonder if his parents are going to rebuild that chimney?

Many people do. I’ve seen it here in Eureka many times. When an earthquake damaged our chimney back in the early ’90s, I tore it down. The part sticking above the roof, anyway. But I can think of two very large chimneys almost within sight of my house that were damaged and repaired. Now they have the potential to be damaged again or even collapse.

Make that three or more chimneys if you count the Arkley’s. Theirs were damaged back in the 2010(?) quake and they seemed to go to some effort and expense to rebuild them. I had to ask Cherie Arkley why they went through all that effort when they could have simply replaced the damaged sections above the roof with stovepipe. She just shook her head and almost glared at me. Some folks just like brick chimneys.

With that in mind, why are we still using traditional bricks for chimneys? I would think it wouldn’t be too difficult to come up with a simulated brick made out of something akin to what they used for space shuttle tiles: super light, fireproof but durable. Make bricks out of something like that and I would think the hazards of earthquake vs. brick chimneys would pretty much be eliminated, yet you’d still have the brick appearance some insist upon.

I’m wouldn’t expect people to rush out and replace their brick chimneys with the phony ones, but on new construction and repairing earthquake damaged ones, seems a lightweight alternative would make perfect sense.

All right, entrepreneurs, let’s develop those artificial bricks.

Addendum: A fellow replying to my comment in the Press- Democrat advises me such artificial bricks are already being used, although I’m not sure they’re exactly what I was proposing.

 posted by Fred Mangels


[Update Wednesday, August 27, 2014]

Fred’s Comment Section produces some brilliant Fred-style homespun wit. (Or should I say, “worthless opinions”?):

Anonymous Anonymous said…

You, a non-1%er, dare question an Arkley? The nerve.

9:37 AM

 

Blogger Fred Mangels said…

Oh, stop it.

I just asked why they were going through all that hassle for a chimney that might well get damaged again. I think her glaring at me was just she felt stove pipe would be tacky. I don’t think so, but it’s their money to waste.

9:48 AM

[UPDATE II – In his own words :: Better Fred than me.]

Blogger Fred Mangels said…

I’m not sure what they used. I drove by there today to see if I could refresh my memory but couldn’t tell if it was real brick or that veneer stuff. Maybe someone hip to construction could tell?

I do know I mentioned to Cheri it seemed foolish to put up another brick chimney when it might just get damaged again. She replied that the way they were doing it, it shouldn’t be a problem.

Whatever. I still don’t think it would have looked any worse if they just replaced the chimneys with stove pipes, but maybe that’s because I’m a low class kind of guy. [Emphasis mine]

–Joe

Written by Joe Blow

August 27, 2014 at 6:29 pm

The American Way

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Another Murderous Milestone: 60 Years of Carnage

WRITTEN BY CHRIS FLOYD
SATURDAY, 28 JUNE 2014 16:15

 

This month, the world has marked significant historical milestones: the 70th anniversary of the D-Day landing (and unmarked, except in Russia, the 70th anniversary of the Red Army’s Operation Bagration, the largest battle in world history, in which the Soviets broke the back of the Nazi army); and the 100th anniversary of the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand in Sarajevo, the spark that led to the First World War.

But this week saw the anniversary of another major turning point in modern history, a campaign that became — and remains — the enduring template of foreign policy for the world’s most powerful nation. We speak, of course, of the 60th anniversary of Washington’s “regime change” operation in Guatemala, overthrowing a democratically elected government.

It was not the first such American “intervention,” of course (and was preceded in the previous year by a more indirect role in overthrowing democracy in Iran), but it set in train more than six decades of violent attacks on democracy by the “leader of the free world.” (A fine tradition carried on by Barack Obama in Honduras.) In fact, a hatred of democracy — a genuine, visceral revulsion at the idea of people choosing their own leaders and their own form of society — has been a driving force in American foreign policy for generations. Democracy and freedom are only allowed if they lead to outcomes that advance whatever the agenda of the American elite happens to be at any given time. They hate democracy abroad; they hate it at home; they hate it everywhere, all the time. The historical record is remarkably consistent on this point.

The Guatemala regime change was noted at the London Review of Books, however, in a piece by John Perry. Below are some excerpts:

Over ten days in June 1954, a decade after the D-Day landings, the CIA sent twelve planes to drop bombs and propaganda on towns in Guatemala in support of a coup against the elected government of Jácobo Arbenz …. …

In the last raid on 27 June, the SS Springfjord, a British merchant ship that had survived capture by the Nazis in 1940, was attacked in the port of San Jose. It was alleged to be unloading arms. After a warning pass – the ship’s captain gave the pilot a friendly wave – a 500lb bomb was dropped down its chimney. It turned out to be loading coffee and cotton.

Guatemala was one of the first countries in the region to emerge from military dictatorship. Arbenz was the second democratic president, elected in 1951 with 65 per cent of the vote. A strongly nationalist military officer, he was convinced that the central problem in a mainly agricultural country was land: 70 per cent of it in the hands of only 2 per cent of the population, of which only a quarter was being cultivated. In 1953 he decreed the takeover of more than 200,000 acres of unused land belonging to the United Fruit Company. The company responded with a propaganda campaign to convince Eisenhower not to be ‘soft on communism’.

It worked. Arbenz, realising that a coup was being plotted, bought a secret shipment of arms from Czechoslovakia. Uncovered by the CIA, this enabled Eisenhower to warn of a possible ‘communist dictatorship’ and support Arbenz’s rival, Carlos Castillo Armas. His insurgents invaded on 18 June, but failed to take control of the towns they targeted. The coup could easily have been a flop. But the CIA raids that culminated in the bombing of the Springfjord unnerved the Guatemalan army command, who withdrew their support from Arbenz. By the evening of 27 June he’d resigned.

Within a month, military dictatorship had resumed under Castillo Armas, with a new government recognised by Eisenhower. After a visit in 1955, Vice-President Nixon said that Guatemala was the ‘first instance in history where a communist government has been replaced by a free one’. US-backed military regimes ruled until 1996. By then some 200,000 people had died in civil war, most at the hands of government forces.

Our 21st century intervention in Iraq has killed far more people much more quickly, of course. But as we gear up for yet another round of slaughter in the country we have recently demolished, it’s good to be reminded that none of this is new or unusual; it is, very simply — and quite horribly — the way the bipartisan American elite do business. Violence is their profession, their religion, their guiding light. They use violence to advance their agenda, then use more violence to deal with the inevitable horrific consequences spawned by their violence, on and on in an endless cycle.


–Joe

Written by Joe Blow

June 28, 2014 at 10:42 pm

The Brownshirt Solution is a Real Life Tragedy

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Where it all starts: The Brownshirt Real Life Tragedy as they touch REAL people with Totalitarian Solutions.

In the 150 years or so since the Civil War you would naturally believe, after all the World Wars, all the fighting and dying, all the sacrifices that were paid for the right to be free men and women we would be living in a modern utopia of glutinous freedoms and liberties, with universal justice. Rather than living in a world of barbaric cannibals daily gorging themselves on – eating our rights to be free and independent citizens charting our course in this life to all our unalienable rights, i.e.,

“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.”

What we get, and this is a good example, of the real time social barbarism and terrorist philosophy that drives or empowers such dark age beliefs. In America the victims are just thrown into solitary confinement for life – a form of tortured murder or execution. It’s called indefinite detention without trial, in some cases. These beliefs are then translated into laws that justified some of the worlds most abhorrent despots and murderous tyrants. Today millions of Americans are incarcerated and for what? Not being white? How many innocent people were forced to plead to a police frame-up that stupid or racist jurors and corrupt judges rubber-stamped into prison?

I’m talking about this blog and this particular article: “Another tragic incident, with a pitiful outcome well short of Justice” – Be sure to read the comments to get the full impact.

It all seems innocuous enough, right. Just conversation trying to work out a reasonable solution.

What makes this serious for everyone is how this kind of conduct extrapolate into real life and dramatically affects our social community to its everlasting detriment. You can’t spit on the sidewalk without committing a felony. The police are lawless in their own right and replicate that attitude when dealing with everyone. When was the last time anyone challenged Humboldt Superior Court Judge Dale Reinholtsen for that position or any other Superior Court Judge?

Knee-jerk justice speaks for itself. Extreme knee-jerk laws tend to create injustice. You can’t cure a disease by trying to treat the symptoms.

When I first read this article I accidentally reblogged it as a test of the feature. When it didn’t show up on my Blogger Page I assumed it didn’t work. WordPress Reblog only works on WordPress Blogs. When I noticed it had worked I decided to leave it with an additional caveat. I wouldn’t want anyone to think I was supporting a Brownshirt blog.

–Joe

Another tragic incident, with a pitiful outcome well short of Justice

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Tuluwat Examiner

The vehicles involved reportedly looked like this The vehicles involved reportedly looked like this

from Times-Standard:

“Following a DUI accident in February that caused major injuries to Naomi Perras’ 55-year-old mother Sheila Fine and 39-year-old cousin Phillip James Keeney. Jerrica Taylor was sentenced Friday by Humboldt Superior Court Judge Dale Reinholtsen included four years of supervised probation and 365 days in jail, with one of those being suspended. An outcome the daughter of one of the victims said was inadequate.”

We agree. First of all, Taylor will never serve anything close to a year in jail. Supervised probation in this county is a joke.
Violating probation in this county doesn’t hold any real consequences.

“Naomi Perras said her mother feels blessed to be alive because her surgeon told her he had never seen someone live after that many fractures. “My mother broke both her legs, all compound fractures, and has had multiple surgeries,” Perras said. “The last one…

View original post 277 more words

Written by Joe Blow

June 1, 2014 at 9:32 pm

Posted in Uncategorized

The Rise of the Blogging Brownshirts

with one comment

[UPDATE Below] 

The deadly Brownshirt Trolls are hard at work spreading their lying filth and disease-ridden innuendo wherever someone will let them. Blogger Brownshirts are self-defined by their actions that equate to their predecessors’ historical murderous conduct; THEY PERSONALLY ASSAULT PEOPLES’ CREDIBILITY, INTEGRITY, HONESTY AND LEGITIMACY to shut them up permanently.

On April  15, 2014, I included the following thoughts in another re-posted article. In view of the current situation manifesting in local blogs, it appears it needs to be reemphasized:

If you don’t know, Brownshirts are a collection of thugs who get quite annoyed at those who oppose” them, their judging, their propaganda, wanton personal hyperbolic attacks and their sick never-ending filthy lies they believe they have the god-given right to assault with anyone they want. In the real world of yesterday they were nothing more than a gang of bullying political murderers that paraded around in all their glorious self-righteous impunity. Today, none of them are of the 1% oligarchic plutocracy, but they serve them just the same as their modern-day “Brownshirts.”

When you censor and block dissenting commenters you reveal yourself as a sponsor, enabler and protector of these vicious Brownshirt Trolls.

So far I’ve identified five of blogs providing a safe-haven for two chapters of Brownshirts.

One of these blogs I’ve already identified and written about. The others, not wanting at this time to provide easy access or advertise in their behalf, I won’t post any links. Just know that when you see these pictures where you are.

If you read Eric Kirk and His Brownshirts – Called Out Again below, you can easily recognize the Brownshirt Trolls’ method of operation as Eric Kirk provides a perfect demonstration. First, should you choose to make a dissenting comment about the blog article or any of it’s affirming commentary, you will be challenged by the most personal and vilifying diatribe, hyperbole, innuendo, and out right lies such as: “Only an idiot or a crazy lunatic would say that or take that opinionated position.” Those kinds of filthy personal accusations are directed at the credibility and integrity of the person making the comment and NOT at the substance of the comment. But not so in Eric Kirk’s mind.

In his mind the opinion or idea – the position – is idiotic or crazy. But that is NOT what he said and wrote.

Should the hapless victim try to defend him or herself, they have just proved Kirk’s assertion (accusation) that they are either an idiot, crazy or both. Who but such people would conflate themselves with their “position” or worthless opinions rattling around in their empty heads and be “personally” offended? Score another one for the Brownshirts.

The problem when entering one of the Brownshirt Havens is you are stepping into a maze of quicksand totally in the dark. Most of the blogs never post any kind of guidelines or rules for making comments on their blogs. Those that do post something use them to discriminate against anyone they don’t like. Clearly, in the example above, Kirk’s personal accusation deviates from the blog article or it’s theme no matter what it might be. Yet, it is the defender that the rule, oftentimes unspoken “rule,” is used against should that person dare object to the personal off-theme attack.

In the world of blogging I would consider these thug, bullying Brownshirt’s antics incidental and irrelevant. Between the gossip-mongering, hatemongering, ridiculing, and lying about what people say, most of these blogs are nothing more than Troll Dens serving as home-bases for a Brownshirt Chapter. They possess NO credibility whatsoever.  I’ve learned over a lifetime that when these kinds of people raised their viperous heads and began spewing their dishonest vitriol and it was generally passed off by the decent folk as a fad — well lets just say, they lived to regret their amorphous judgments. Taken literally, the original Brownshirts, their political and general philosophy for existence; what guided and justified their actions as compared to these local Brownshirts, is a mere bullet.

Everything, all creation, starts with an idea. Once that idea becomes accepted commonplace it materializes into reality. These Blogger Brownshirts are only one bullet away from that reality.

[UPDATE :: Friday, May 23, 2014]

I’ve identified another Haven. This comment is another good example that the blog owner affirms and lets go unchallenged for blatant bald-faced lying. Brownshirts’ purpose is to SILENCE all dissenters – people that don’t bow down and worship the Plutocratic Oligarchy they support, empower and defend. I, frankly do NOT give a rat’s ass who agrees or does NOT agree with me.

MOLA42

May 22, 2014 at 12:13

I wonder….

There’s some guy out there who lately has taken to calling everyone who disagrees with him “Brown Shirts.” It would be very disappointing to find out Mr. Berg and this other fellow were one and the same.

For the record, no one is “evil” (except puppy abusers) and no one is a saint. We are just a bunch of folks trying to figure out the best way through this mess called life.

(Who made this scummy bastard God? “For the record” that statement is just his worthless opinion, and I do mean worthless. The fact that he presumes to speak for everyone belies his wannabe truth – what makes him illegitimate.)

When someone disagrees with us (Progressive, Regressive, Conservative, Liberal) it does not mean someone wants to get the trains going so they can ship their opponents to the Death Camps. It’s supposed to be a civil discussion, where consensus is reached and we make policy for ourselves we can all live with.

(No, in his case, they just put a bullet in your head – they censor you, they block you the moment you reject their lying false accusations and disease-ridden innuendo – see above. In that he mirrors his true father, and He is truly the Evil Father of the Lie. “Civility” died with the first lie. The Brownshirts turned it all into war.)

It starts with listening. [Emphasis Mine.]

–Joe

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